Comments ( 14 )

• so in the Crain’s article we read in the beginning:

  >>>But retail, for the most part, has been an afterthought. As a result, these booming neighborhoods are “a little dysfunctional,” says Sharon Kahan, a commercial real estate broker in Chicago with CB Richard Ellis Group Inc.”>>Ultimately, it may take more new buildings to solve the problem, particularly in the poorer areas that surround the wealthy ones.

  “I hate to say it, but additional development is the only thing that is going to solve the retail puzzle. You need to have the space available and the population to support it,” says Brent Ryan, assistant professor of urban planning and policy at the University of Illinois at Chicago

• Often times new development doesn’t bring the type of walkable street retail people want in the city. It seems the most successful commercial strips come up organically in small piece-by-piece storefront rennovations.

• The story seems a wee bit off to me.

  River East has decent grocery shopping and decent nightlife. The South Loop has Roosevelt Road with a Dominicks, Jewel, and Target. Plus other shopping options.

  I’m not saying it is perfect shopping wise but it seems to me they found a premise and then wrote the story. It should be find the story and then write the premise.

  Oh well who am I to criticize big time journalists. I’m just a reader.

• good grief, I just realize my post got chopped off and reformatted in a bad way…

  I meant to point out that it strikes me that the urban planner doesn’t seem to have a good grasp on what planning is while the real estate broker does.

  How is simply adding more residential going to add retail?

  pirate, I am in the south loop every weekday – given the scale of all the new high rises, there is so little foot traffic around here it’s astonishing.

  I understand the weekends are a bit busier at the restaurants on Wabash (a good sign), but I don’t think your average resident of the Michigan Ave and east developments walk to anything further west than the L station (especially in the winter, when the wind whipping down Roosevelt Rd can knock you off your feet). But it’s more than just shopping, it’s night life, which is pretty absent in these parts.

• Carter — I don’t think the planner is saying that simply adding residential is going to solve the retail problem. He’s saying there needs to be enough people in the area to support the retail (enough potential customers). The article points out that while there is a lot of new residential development in these areas, they’re still basically small islands of population and don’t yet have the same critical mass of people in the surrounding neighborhoods needed to support a thriving local retail market, like Lakeview or Wicker Park have.

  For example, Lakeview’s 100,000 residents can support businesses that serve all of your daily needs — not just shopping, restaurants, entertainment and night life, but also those little errands like a lighting and fan store, hardware stores, locksmiths, veterinarians, dentists, and other things people might otherwise have to leave the neighborhood for. You need more than just a grocery store and night life for a great neighborhood.

• I agree that South Loop remains a bit of a bedroom community on the lake for the residents. The ratio of foot traffic to the large buildings is odd. Parking is difficult for the outsider… but how is this different from the Goldcoast, Lincoln Park, Loop, most of Lakeview etc…? I think if you’re a resident of any of these hoods, you either have a parking space or permits, don’t own a car, or understand parking is difficult in the city.

  However, I’m in South Loop socially and for business quite a bit. My wife and have commented all things being equal, (with no kids), we would like to live in South Loop considering our means and lifestyle. Its the best way to get us close to the lake, have a few local spots we like, and we can get to the family in the burbs easy (Lemont, Addison etc…). So for us, lifelong North Siders, it is a viable option with our present values, wants and needs.

  Retail is adequate north of 15th. South of there, forget it.

  Of course the story is making for solutions to the preceived lack of retail. The Crains story seems to infer that there is some magical valuation for adequate retail. How much retail and how close should it be? Not all neighborhoods must be cut from the same cloth. South Loop has a great feel for what it is: A mixed area of young professionals, retirees, spattering of familys, ecletics and students hugging the lake, Loop, Printers Row and liking it.

  Streeterville is a little more extreme in this case. I think its for people who want to live on the lake or right on top of where they work. Otherwise, I don’t see retail happening unless you do some indoor mall type of stuff like at Hancock building.. except tailored for everyday services etc. I saw this type of retail and services tucked into highrise and midrise buildings in Hamburg, Germany a Sister City of Chicago’s. Its mall-like, but easily accessible for heart of the city dwellers.
  Again, how can you expect quaint retail in a cramped office space/hospital district like Streeterville? You are close to River North here for nightlife… easy walk or cab.

• I don’t disagree that there are issues with retail and restaurants/nightlife in those areas.

  It just seems to me that the author exaggerated the lack of grocery options in at least a few of the hoods. The River East area has a Dominicks, Treasure Island and some independent grocery stores. It certainly lacks smaller retail.

  Perhaps the next incarnation of “North Pier” or whatever they are calling the “arts center” today can have some retail and small offices and shops.

  As for the south Loop outside Roosevelt Road it is largely a retail wasteland. Some nightlife in the northern part of the area.

  There are certainly issues. I just think the author was wrong on a few points, but right in a broader context.

• People talk about the low foot traffic to large building ratio in the South Loop. One factor, which was discussed in the article, is that retail development lags residential development. Another factor, which so many people seem to conveniently ignore, is that almost half of the large buildings in the South Loop are not fully completed, and thus don’t have anyone living in there yet.

  I moved to the South Loop about 15 months ago, and I’ve seen a decent-sized increase in foot traffic and retail over these 15 months. There is no doubt in my mind that the amount of foot traffic next summer will be considerably greater than it is this summer, and that the amount of foot traffic in the summer of ’09 will be considerably greater than what it will be in the summer of ’08? Why? I can think of numerous reasons….the Columbian, One Museum Park, Roosevelt Collection, Vetro, Vision on State, Printers Corner, Burnham Pointe, 1720 South Michigan, Library Tower, 626 South Clark, Reebie Lofts, One Museum Park West, 900 South Clark, Astoria Tower, 1 East 8th, 1600 Museum Park, Lexington Park, Marquee Michigan, 1555 South Wabash, Michigan Avenue Tower II are all good reasons!

  Thousands of new residents over the next year or two will continue to bring a lot more foot traffic to the nieghborhood, and while there will be a lag, as the article mentioned, a lot more retail will come in. I know that some people are impatient and expect restaurants, shops, and bars to set up shop on a site next to 6 high rises under construction….but I think that a smart business would probably realize that they won’t make money when the only people coming in would be construction workers coming in for an after-work beer and burger….and that they’d be better off waiting a year or two until the buildings are completed and there will be enough residents nearby to run a successful business.

  Not to say that retail and activity isn’t growing in the South Loop as is. Whether or not you like big boxes, you cannot deny that the Roosevelt corridor isn’t booming with Southgate market opening (and anchor tenant Whole Foods opening tomorrow), the recent opening of Home Depot, and the Best Buy that is currently being built….among many other stores recently built or going to be built in that area. New restaurants/retail are continuing to open further south in the South Loop, as evidenced by the recent openings of Room 21 and South Coast. Plus you have the Spertus Museum and Blackstone Hotel opening soon, and McCormick Place and the surrounding area looking like it will continue to grow.

  I guess what I am trying to say in my long-winded post are two things – that all we need is just a little patience (to quote Axl Rose). And to use another quote for my other point – if you build it, they will come.

• Where does “South Loop” stop and “Bronzeville” begin?

• We draw the line between the South Loop and Bronzeville at the Stevenson Expy.

• I’m glad of the development on roosevelt and on maxwell st. I can pretty stay south of north ave. No offense north siders i can’t stand the traffic or the pretentious of the north side.

• I think I’m the last holdout on this one, but South Loop stops at Roosevelt ave. South of Roosevelt is “near south side”.

• The summer of 2007 appears to mark a turning point in the Near South Side at least. Much more foot traffic this summer than last. The headless sculptures in Grant Park, the new dog park, Yolk, Exposure, Marble Slab (even if it is a chain) all opened recently, even with all the in-progress towers.

  I hope this nice neighborhood doesn’t turn into streeterville, but can strike the right balance between population desity, amenities, and busineses and at the same time develop a neighborhood feeling.

• The area that I never understood not taking off (and benefitting from) is the Near West Side. The United Center makes for prime foot traffic, especially if bars/restaurants/retails were close. The accessibility to nearby neighborhoods, downtown, mass transit and the expressways. Instead, it looks like a vast parking lot; not that I would want it to look like a minature-Wrigleyville, but something could be done especially with all the residential developments and low-income housing on the way out in that area.